Fantastic second episode of the gut check project and we have our inaugural guests this is going to be a fantastic show. I’m super excited about this. I’m pretty pumped also. So today we have this is episode number two of the gut check project brought to you by you Your host, Dr. Kenneth Brown, I’m Eric Rieger. And well we really appreciate everyone joining us. Did you know we actually have feedback from our first show? That’s what
I’ve heard. I’ve actually been contacted by a lot of people. I thought that you and I were just talking to each other the whole time. As it turns out, some people were actually listening. What do you what do you know, beyond my mom,
beyond my wife, your wife, we actually had some other people who watched so that was really cool. Hey, one of the things that we had though in terms of questions was, can I take Atrantil, and do I need to continue taking probiotics or prebiotics may want to address that real quick
so there’s lots of confusion around these terms prebiotic probiotic all the prebiotic is and and digestible food source that your bacteria will break down. So fiber is a prebiotic. Okay, so the skins of vegetables and fruits are prebiotics. Probiotics are the good bacteria that people want to take in to replenish your microbiome. The reality of When you’re taking out trying to you don’t need to take a prebiotic or a probiotic, in fact, the molecules known as polyphenols are actually a form of a prebiotic. They go to your colon, the bacteria will break it down into beneficial things. So essentially, it not to be too confusing but you’re basically taking a form of a prebiotic by definition by taking out truncal. So no, it’s not necessary to take a pre or probiotic. If you feel better on the probiotic I say continue to take it if you do not feel better than you might want to hold off on that. So if last week, if you’re a listener and you’re curious about trying Atrantil you can learn more at love my tummy.com forward slash spoonie that’s love my tummy.com and for discount us forward slash spoonie.
Also, just a reminder, if you ever want to kick catch up with Dr. Brown, and what he’s doing, he has a brand new website called KBMD d health.com. So it is only a week old. There might be a bug or There,
there’s actually probably a lot of bugs in there. And there’s probably a few things that we’re going to have to change. And I encourage all the feedback. If you don’t like the language, if you want to change the wording, there’s a couple pictures of myself that I would change. But you know, we have to do what we can do and get things up. Because that website is there to give information about things that we know that at least my patients are swimming towards us and asking questions. So we’re going to have all kinds of information on CBD on gut health, on sleep on brain protection on everything, it’s just a platform. So we want to get it up there and also to give access to people to get high quality CBD to get access to all Toronto and so on. So, yes, there. We encourage feedback. Hit me up Tell me, Nick, you’re not a English major, or you may know English majors. Yeah.
Me bad at language also. So basically, Eric Rieger and I made this website and there’s probably some grammatical errors and we would love it. We learned about it sooner than later. I know what you’re talking about. But do check out KBMD health com because there is a lot there. It’s going to be resourceful. There’s lots of research, there is a store where you will find the brand new KB, MD CBD as well as Atranti. And we’ll have other things added to the store as we put research behind it.
Yeah, so when you say research, this is one of the things that I’m most excited about. We’re gonna have a guest on today and we’re going to be talking CBD and the cannabis industry and all of that super smart guy Shawn Bryans was just talking to him outside and I’m just I love his story. And you guys gotta stick with this show today because it’s going to be super exciting. But one of the things that I want to do is I really want to do clinical research on my patients. It’s not necessarily research, I just want to track the results. And we’re going to be putting those kinds of things first on the website, as we await publication and then once we get published, then we’ll go ahead and replace that but anybody going to that website is going to see the white papers first before while they’re being submitted for publication the way it works. You submit it takes a few months, this is just a way to get access to things much sooner
much sooner. Last mentioned here real quick for a sponsor that we had for the show, Red Zone. We just happen to know the the medical director of red zone and it happens to be Dr. J up also a gastroenterologist. At the top of the hour, you probably heard if you’re listening already, the mentioned erogenous zone and it was being read by the late great doc Thompson. So shout out to Dr. Thompson. Again. Thanks so much for having us here. The team, Chef Patrick, Ron, everyone. couldn’t be happier to now start our second episode of the gut check project on spoonie radio so we we did not get pulled off the air last week, which prize and they actually said you can come back and do another show. I brought another shirt. That’s amazing.
So it’s been a week. Before we jump into all the cool stuff that we’re going to talk about today. What do you been up to man? It’s been a week.
It has been a week. So last week, my oldest son, the whole family my youngest son, my wife and I took tons of family down to San Antonio, we live in North Texas if you’re not familiar, that’s five hours. drive south went and saw my oldest son compete in the state basketball tournament they did well. And then after that we didn’t quite win the whole thing. So we decided to take off and enjoy some family time out in San Diego. We I don’t know I logged around a couple hundred bucks I guess on line scooters. If you are looking for a way to enjoy an urban environment, run a line scooter. Similar while you’re out, did you get a chance to jump into one of the Navy SEAL bud training techniques of water cold immersion. We did decide not to do that after we put on a wetsuit and tried to search and it’s cold water is not warm at all. wet suit is correct. You’re wet you’re wet and cold and and you’re still wet but we did serve it just got out of there as soon as we accomplished what we what we went to do do it for you. yourself are you been?
Wow, I had an equally exotic experience I had to go to which I didn’t have to. I went to Wichita Falls Texas because my son had a tennis tournament there. And my wife and daughter went down to waco because she had a tennis tournament there which coincidentally shout out to her Carla she double gold singles and dies won the whole tournament love that. My son Lucas and I in Wichita if you’ve ever been there, it’s windy. Very, very windy can be Yeah, and it was raining and so we had tons of rain delays and all the stuff I did bring my x three bar, which I’ll be writing about this also but the x three bar is a portable exercise system developed by a PhD named john Jake wish and I had a long conversation with him not too long ago and he’s done some great research showing how variable resistance and blah blah The bottom line is, I sat in a hotel room, worked out watch rainfall and was probably as wet and cold. You
Yeah, without question. I don’t know if you know this or not but Wichita Falls in Texas actually is the region that varies the most from year to year and temperature fluctuation. It has the biggest swing, I believe throughout the entire state shocked probably back me up on this by the time it gets in here, but it literally has the biggest average temperature swing throughout the entire state, that little region out there around the Red River and described a little bit about what the x three bar looks like. Because if you had never seen this thing, it’s really cool. It’s very portable. It’s equipped with bands but it has a hazard resistance motion that you know if you’re just looking at anything that looks weird, but when you try it it will where you’re at
Yeah, but anybody’s interested in this. I actually Dr. Jake rich gave me a code so that our listeners could actually get a discount. Oh, nice. Just when you go you go to x three bar.com and then put in code KBMD D and you’ll get a nice discount there. Yeah, the science is pretty interesting. I’m all about biohacking. This is like one of those small bio hacks that you can do and show it’s boring. You know, there’s no excuses for not working out takes about 10 minutes and you’re done. So you will break a sweat you will think that you won’t but you will break a sweat. In fact, if you go to the our Instagram atKBMD health none there’s no need to do there as a definitely need to do this because you can see big man Eric over here is not doing some parallels with the x three bar Actually, I’ve got several videos of the x three bars, so I’ll borrowed someone else’s biceps to do that. Yeah, he actually had to stop mid workout because he was getting too big. Yeah. And I was worried about changing his wardrobe. So yeah, I wouldn’t be a fitness shirt.
Real quick. Any other news or notes that we need to talk about for the gut check project coming up. I can’t think of anything big other than we have our first guest this week, but I know that you went to where he works. While you’re up in Wichita Falls. Yeah, that’s right.
So coincidentally, and we’d already had him booked for this. I went up a Wichita Falls is right next to the border of Oklahoma. Oklahoma just recently became a I’m going to say the word wrong but medical Cannabis legal state. Yes. Is that a term that Shawn can clarify. We have john here. Yeah, he’s going to tell us all about it about what goes on. Yeah, so I went up there and took a look and our CBD product is in that in that store and it was really cool to see all the hard work that we have done to educate and get things moving. And so if you get a chance, you know, Oklahoma’s one of the newest states to start to medical marijuana
interestingly enough, though, I do find it kind of perplexing that Texas being such a large state watches at the bordering states open up a casino or open up the opportunity for medical delivery of cannabis or CBD. And essentially they it’s it’s Texas citizens that more or less kind of support that industry and I’m sure this will be the same until Texas decides to participate. I’m I’m very familiar with that because I’m from Nebraska originally where that’s exactly what’s going on. We got Colorado one side Island, the other right I will do The casinos Colorado, of course, has the cannabis industry and Nebraska has chosen to be very strict on that. So not surprising to me that a state can have neighboring states with a little bit more liberal or differing views. Sure. Now I understand well, I believe listeners, what we’re going to try to start doing is giving a little bit of format in our first hour. So at this point time, we’re going to talk about health news as it relates to the gut check project and KBMD health and you’re going to learn firsthand why. I always like talking to Dr. Brown in terms of how he keeps up with what’s the latest trends and the latest relevant news in health. So this last week, and we’ve got a little bit of experience with what we’re going to talk about, but it just so happens there’s a lot of research into the fasting, mimicking diet and what it can do for you and I’m going to stop there and let you can’t take over.
So super interesting. I study was published just last week, about the fasting mimicking diet. Now what the fastest mimicking diet is, is this is developed by a fantastic researcher named valter Longo. And what you do is he figured out in animals that if you give a caloric restriction, meaning you’re going to take about 1000 calories the first day and then work your way down to about 10, to about 10% of your normal calories in a very specific ratio of fats, proteins and carbs, that you can trick your body into believing that it’s in a fast and what that does in humans, he showed that after five days, you turn on your stem cells, it actually gets your old cells, sick and old cells to just go away called a topology. And so if you can think of it this way, your body says, Okay, these cells that are starting to show signs of possible early cancer, things like that, the body recognizes that and goes, you go away, and we’re going to start new cells. And so that’s the basis of the fasting mimicking diet. This was developed A company called El nutra has developed a product called prologue to sort of make it really simple for you to have the exact ratio. That’s a pro on PR Oh, lol PR o lol So valter has been doing tons of research and you know he’s I follow his work through Rhonda Patrick I fellows work through a lot of other conferences. He’s always going to longevity conferences and giving lectures. This time, something very near and dear to my heart he just published so out of the University of Southern California USC.
This article out of cell reports
the fasting mimicking diet modulates microbiota and promotes intestinal regeneration to reduce inflammatory bowel disease pathology, very long, big, boring title, but here’s what’s super cool is basically he took mice he put them on the fasting mimicking diet and they induced Crohn’s disease and ulcerative colitis, so inflammatory bowel disease. And then he showed that these mice had decreased intestinal inflammation, increased intestinal stem cells, they actually reverse the disease. And something else that’s really cool is that they improved the micro biome composition. And then he actually showed that it improved leaky gut or intestinal permeability. So stop it. Think about this for a moment. We have a disease a chronic disease, inflammatory bowel disease. If you don’t know anybody who has this, it’s brutal. This is what I deal with in my practice all the time. But by putting somebody on a fasting mimicking diet, you can actually reverse this. Then he compared that group to a water only fast. Oh, yeah, this is amazing. The water only fast did not do nearly as well. That’s surprising. I whatnot, I thought that I was completely blown away because I’ve always, I’ve done. I did three fast this year I did three, five day fast. The first one was the prologue one, I did a prologue fast. And I could totally tell when those stem cells kicked in, I just had a boost of energy like you would not believe. Next one I did, I tried to kind of hack the prologue fast Sure, and tried to do it using foods that I bought, and tried to mimic it, I did not quite get that boost of energy, right. And then my third fast was a water only fast for five days. And once again, I did not get that early. I just woke up at like 1am and could take on the world. And so I’ve actually contacted the CEO of El nutra that were actually friends with Joe on tune and him and I talked you said yeah, cuz that’s the amazing thing. We don’t people don’t realize that the fasting mimicking diet is actually based off of true science and animals. voltar did this all he worked out the exact ratio How many days and then after you do this, you have to repeat. So in this particular group, he had two groups of mice, one did water only. And that group did not do as well. The fasting mimicking group had increased bifidobacteria and lactobacilli, which have been shown to improve. So, you asked me at the beginning of the show, what about prebiotics and probiotics? Well, guess what, if you do a fasting period, then your body will figure out what bacteria should proliferate more. When we eat, it’s actually an inflammatory process. So every time you eat, you actually create a little bit of inflammation in the gut by giving it a break. And by doing the fasting mimicking diet. You’re not only giving your gut a break, but your body goes okay, we’re going to get rid of old dying cells get rid of precancerous cells, and we’re going to start brand new ones, and he’s proven it with these mice. What is so fascinating to me is that the fasting mimicking diet is so much easier than the water only I can vouch for that. And we had we actually had our whole company do it at altran to I think we have that on our, on our page. We did a blog or Yeah,
I think it’s right at a year ago. That is That’s correct. And I can I can say the water fast. It’s not the worst thing ever, but it’s more difficult the whenever your body decides you need to eat, and you have a in flux, I believe it’s called a Rex. And that makes you think, okay, you’re ravenous and you need to eat and you have a burst of energy simply to go out and find food. And I was actually somewhat envious of those who had done the prologue as the control because they, including you, at that point, time did not have the same drive to go out and just eat Yeah, you were fasting, but at the same time, your body seemed to be tolerating a little bit better.
Yeah. When we start thinking about fasting I actually after this article got published, I realized that another article just recently got published where they looked at the different fasting types in religion and you know, we have Ramadan We’ve got young to poor, lots of similarities, lots of similar as we have the Daniel fast we have lent, which I’m Catholic, but you know, we probably should be fasting in a more serious way where that but it’s just interesting that fasting is could be one of the easiest life hacks ever. It’s amazing that so many religions had that that are based in so much age and tradition that there are lots of things between religions that actually are incredibly similar and it also comes down to fasting. So the reason why this is such a big deal is because I had my Crohn’s and colitis patients and if you do have Crohn’s or colitis or you know, anybody that does, please share this, so that we can, you know, help everybody with this because I don’t think a lot of doctors are talking about fasting now. And so I think my little hat here is going to be the fasting mimicking diet, plus are trying to for the polyphenol effect, and we also know that it gets rid of the bad bacteria that’s growing where it shouldn’t be. plus CBD which attenuates your immune system right? Could be the magic So I called up Joe, the CEO of L neutron, we got to talking about this. And he goes, I want to come down, I want to do the show, let’s talk. And I’m like, Yes, let’s do this. This is going to be fantastic. So we’re going to have a whole episode dedicated to the fasting, mimicking diet and the science of it, and how you know how people can realize that it really kind of resets and it’s an anti aging thing also. So
it said that you can do from home, is it something that’s going to require someone to go out and get a prescription don’t need a prescription to do a fasting mimicking diet, you simply just have to schedule the time to do it, and then commit to it. And then I would imagine you being a gastroenterologist, if you see somebody make those kinds of improvements, that’s really all you want is the best for your patient. And if they can handle that on their own and escape disease, it’s a win for everyone. And it’s natural. It’s natural to do it.
So in Vaulters studies, it’s really exciting because what he showed is it is anti aging. It is anti inflammatory. And what’s really fun is that he also showed that you have to refeed so once you do that, and you you have the discipline to Do those five days of decrease caligra of calories and using the fasting mimicking diet when you start repeating it is awesome because and he also showed that if you do it three times in a year, that is equivalent to doing ketogenic diet year round. So, yeah, he showed that in different animal models also. So for those who are out there, keep going and if you’re if you’re struggling cuz there’s many who don’t struggle, but if you are struggling, maybe this is an alternative. Have you ever done keto? I have done it and I have fallen off of it and gotten back on and fallen off. It’s I mean, it’s not the again, not the hardest thing ever, but the discipline to stay there. If you have a family. I mean, if you if you cook for kids, then that’s not what they want to do. That’s difficult. Joe Rogan had Dr. Addy on and they’re kind of joking. Apparently they both have young kids and they were talking about the how they just kind of ruin their diets by making peanut butter jelly sandwiches for the kids and cutting off the crust. Joe just would just eat the crust off of course. I did that also. So every time I’ve done keto i would i would lapse without trying to laps I would end up doing dirty keto. Sure, I would just be like, Oh, it’s bacon and eggs, although as much as I want and then later, I’ll be like, wow, I’m sure I can have this bowl of rice.
Yeah, well, you know it but with keto, if I remember correctly, you were talking about lab results even on yourself that where there’s advantages to doing keto, but if you end up doing like you call the dirty keto, you might actually throw your your desired results off because your body is booted, doing fats, and you’ve basically thrown in this carbohydrate and talk a little bit about that real quick.
So I didn’t I like to do, but so one of my problems and we’re going to probably get into that a little bit with Shawn when he comes on when I do something, I go all the way. So I’ll try it. So I’ll just go keto. And then over a period of time, I didn’t realize that I was I’d listened to a Ben Greenfield podcast I’m like, Oh, I need to have black lentils now because Whatever, you know, you name it, and I totally forget that that’s going on. So my functional medicine doctor, his name is Kevin Wilson here in town. And you know, he practices anti aging, functional medicine and he took my blood and called me up. He’s like, what have you been doing? And of course, what we were doing is, I’m messing with my diet. Yeah, I’m experimenting with different supplements because we’re trying to develop more products, right? And I’m not really paying attention that I’m doing everything at once at the same time. Sure. And all of a sudden, he’s just like, your labs are messed up, buddy. Talk and I’m like, Oh, he’s like, what do you been doing? And I was like, you don’t have enough time?
I’ve been doing it all he’s like, I mean, I’m gonna go just everything.
Yeah, it makes it difficult to find out but that’s for sure. But I will say that every single thing that you’ve ever recommended to a patient for as long as I’ve known you, you’ve tried it on yourself first.
I have 100% done that. So I have always done in fact, this is this is not new. I remember being a medical student and I I was in Lexington, Nebraska, running the ER at night. So I was like the only person awake in Lexington, Nebraska at the time. And I decided to teach myself how to do an IV on myself. Sure, which is hard.
Yeah, it is, especially the first time.
So let’s see, I’ve tried to stick it in G tube down myself. That didn’t work. So well. I’ve done an art. I did an arterial line on myself one time. That’s ridiculous. Yeah, that’s not Don’t Don’t do that. Don’t do any of this. As a matter of fact, don’t do any of that. I’m just saying that. I will do it so that you don’t have to
the sheer pain of an arterial line is about 10 fold of any intravenous line.
I had to laugh there was a comment on my YouTube channel yesterday, where you know, I posted my colonoscopy online. Yeah, on YouTube. Don’t do that either. And I was awake, but it’s hilarious. And I actually texted the tech this morning with this Abby, somebody in the UK said, and you’ll notice that nobody cares about your but we’re all looking at the screen because patients always get nervous that I don’t want you to see my butt and she pointed out the second he said that Abby looked at my butt. And I’ve never noticed that. So colonoscopy, everything. So if I’m not, and this just comes down with everything, I really would never, I want to try things on myself. Then I do a case series with patients. And then I have data to tell people I’m going to say, look, this is what happened to me. This is this group of 20 people over here that we’re working with. That’s why the Crohn’s and colitis community is so near and dear to my heart, because I’m using a lot of different things. And I’m seeing success with them. Sure. And don’t forget, the reason why we are doing gut check project is to talk about KBB health, which was born out of the idea of taking what you find out in the clinic. Are you going from anecdotal to Applied Science and to find out how we can actually help people? Absolutely. And so this is cool. We’re coming down to the I guess the bottom of the hour and radio Patrick? Is that what you guys say bottom of the hour?
Yeah, we’re coming to the bottom of the hour. I’m trying to give 30 seconds but apparently I don’t know how to make a three and zero with
my fingers. No, it’s okay. It’s like you’re calling the foul. You know, it’s, it’s, it’s one of these either way. Hey, we’re going to be back here in a little bit. Shawn Bryans is going to be our first guest ever. You guys are gonna love him. I wish he could grow some facial hair.
I know if he doesn’t, he doesn’t hold back. We’ll see y’all soon.
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Okay, we’re back. We’re back to the second half hour of gut check project episode number two. And now we are joined with our first ever guest. This is Shawn Bryans Shawn Say hello.
Hey, how you guys doing today?
Doing well. So when Eric and I were talking about our first guest, I just said, I don’t care what we talked about, but I want somebody with a beard.
Yeah. I started this in the eighth grade and just just just filled in the patch. Exactly. Yeah. When I turned 30 I look just like Eric.
I’m very proud of my beard.
Well, this is Shawn Bryans. He’s Vice President of Operations at green tree medical. And you are head of the cultivation division, also known as ogee. ARB and green tree medical and odr was located in Oklahoma, just north of Burnett across the Red River Craig. Yes, sir. And you also have a on site medical dispensary called alternative medicine, correct? Yes, we do. All right. Well, tell us a little bit about what goes on there.
Yeah, I think that as one of the coolest things is your background. I personally am so intrigued by that. So I would like you to start from the beginning.
Okay. Well, I grew up in agricultural family, my parents had big tech speed company in Paris, Texas. And so, you know, I really didn’t know what I wanted to do when I graduated high school but I had a passion for pharmacy and biology. So I go to Texas Tech University and I majored in pharmacy there, which was the biology program. Then I changed my major, switched over to agriculture, fell in love with the horticulture and and did a lot of research at East Texas State University and Texas a&m commerce on the cotton plant. Graduated, then I became a ag teacher built greenhouses, taught kids how to grow, went straight into administration became a principal. Did that for 20 years. years and love working with people. So when my son graduated high school and my daughter she’s a bout to be a junior at Texas State. And that’s when I was like, You know what? I am ready to chase my passion. So with Oklahoma, June 26, they passed their full medical cannabis program. And my wife and I were celebrating our 25th anniversary in Arkansas. And we talked about 10 miles that day and I was tired. She was in bed in the cabin, no TV and I just typed up a quick Craigslist ad. And I found three guys that were had little to no knowledge of Cannabis and how we can use that in the medical field. And we made a great connection. And I started working with them. And that’s where I am right now.
Well, that’s awesome. So I’ve known you for quite some time full disclosure. My wife taught for you. You were the first one that hired her whenever she was a math teacher. So I’ve seen Shawn as a principal. I’ve seen him as an assistant superintendent of the school district that was down in Texas, and I’ve seen you much like you can, whenever Shawn decides to do something, he’s all the way from welding to seen the gardens that you’ve you’ve had out back from your house, all the vegetables, you raise chickens. How did you decide that? There was a need, though? You told me this years ago, there’s a need for people to be able to explore the real practical application. Yeah. Far beyond the psychoactive aspects of cannabis. There are people out there that have a need. How did you decide that this is a way that you could make that happen?
Yeah, you know, It really, I’m researching cannabis and I’m learning about it. And I’m sharing this with other people and getting into dialogue with them. And these people, people that I worked with people that I met in a prohibition state of Texas, they are one of their family members had a dire need. And we started discussing, you know, how cannabis could help them with a medical issue. And so I kind of took on the position of a caregiver by being able to share information that that I gained from from research, and keep in mind, you know, now, Dr. Brown can do research in the public, but before it was something that we would just do, you know, Talking to our friends. Well, how did this work with you? What were the effects doing? You know, how did you feel did this, you know, work with this particular element, but now we’re able to discuss more freely. So you know that that’s kind of how I
let me let me ask you a quick question. So you’re I mean, you’re a scientist by nature. I mean, with a background in pharmacology and then horticulture, and then you’re an educator so that you know, primary you started your foundation is in science, then education. Then you get into this industry where there’s so much misinformation how do you how did you approach that where you realize it’s up to, you know, it’s almost like you have a moral obligation to try and get through all the clutter because that is your background. I mean, it’s if somebody looked at you and said, Oh, I could totally see him in the cannabis industry, but they didn’t realize that you were a principal.
Right, right. Yeah, it just research and and educating people. You know, in our dispensary right now when you have a patient come Man, they don’t know what to ask for they, they, they may think I need this strong marijuana that’s got 30% THC. But But what we do is we work with them and let them know that that is not always the answer. Would you
say would you say while you’re there, just sorry to interject. But right now if somebody had a question about a medicine and their physician recommended to them, and they don’t have time to get those answers, that they may have questions about side effects, etc. They’ll go to a pharmacist, and then ask the questions. Hey, can I take this with this? This was just given to me is that this style of y’all, you basically interacting with people and they come in, you’re trying to help steer them towards something that would work?
Yeah. So like the way our medical program works in Oklahoma. Basically, you communicate with your physician. That Hey, I would like to try Medical Cannabis as an alternative, or with your method of treatment that we’re currently doing, and the doctor would rotch you basically it’s a it’s not a prescription for cannabis, but it’s it’s an okay that you can get your medical card and then you come to the dispensary. And that is where we want to work with, you know, the patients to to find out what part of their system is, is out of balance and what we need to do to help them get out get it back into balance.
Is there a term for that person? So in other words, like you said pharmacist, sure. If I go to Colorado was that since it’s a little bit more evolved? Is there a term when I walked in, I need to speak with the
Well, a lot of people call them bud tenders. That term came about, you know, right when medical and recreation And they tended the buds that were in the jars and, you know, knew a little bit about each particular product that was in the jar. Sure. Now, caregivers are, though we don’t act as the caregiver for that individual patient, we are caregivers. And so we are providing, you know, data and information to the patient and let them make their decision. And I always because a lot of times a patient will come in and you know, ask that well, what will this do if I’m taking flex role or if I’m taking hydrocodone or if I’m taking an antibiotic? You know, I always suggest Tell your doctor and let me tell you guys, this is a trick here. It’s It’s really nice. So you go to the doctor with a stomach ache normally You go in you visit with the nurse for 10 minutes takes your pulse, your blood pressure, then the doctor comes in. And, you know, you spend 10 minutes, maybe 15 depending on your situation.
Or if you need a rectal in my case Yeah,
exactly. That’s when I say 30 but
but uh, but now if you if you bring up the topic of CBD, bring up the topic of the cannabinoids and tell that to your doctor say, Hey, I’m I’ve been doing some research here. Let me tell you that doctor is going to sit there for I mean, I’ve had an hour conversation and the doctor has 10 patients lining up outside waiting to see him or her and he’s spending his time with me because he is craving this information. Sure he wants the same from and I want to know what he knows. I want to bounce ideas. You know, off of him. And and Seahawk and bettle better either handle my own situations or with other patients that I’m dealing with
you know, I would say though even here in Texas where it’s not legal yet and of course you know that but I see almost daily it seems like the the openness is is there people are willing to discuss something that maybe even just three years ago, we weren’t going into depth on do you do you find that physicians in Oklahoma are starting to become more embracing now that it’s it’s legal for them to have this isn’t Avenue?
Yeah, most definitely. There was a little bit of fear in the very beginning with with doctors, they thought that they would be labeled as the cannabis doctor or the, you know, kind of like some of them are the opioid doctor, you know, which doctor you could go to to get, you know, drugs like that. And so, the There, there were some that were reluctant to, to even embrace that idea. You know, if you if you’re discussing your health with your doctor, and you know, they do not embrace cannabis, in my opinion. I would, I would want a second, I would want a second opinion I’d want to talk to to another doctor.
Well hang on throws back to Ken real quick. So your gastroenterologist here in Texas licensed here, and I saw you specifically decide there has to be there has to be something behind the science of the CBD. So comparing what Shawn’s talking about what a physician would have to do to move into this movement where it’s now legal, what allowed you to be able to open up and say I want to find out more for the benefit of my patients.
So we touched on this last week, Shawn I just I had no knowledge of the endocannabinoid system, I had no knowledge of CBD marijuana I was. So whenever somebody is ignorant to it, I don’t judge it at all, because I just recently started, you know, learning all of this. And what changed my mind was I went to a conference and I bought a case of very expensive CBD at retail price. Now I’m angry at the company, but whatever. I shouldn’t give me a discount, but, and I gave it away to my patients. And I just waited. And when almost all of them came back and said, I need more. That’s when I knew that okay, there’s something to this. Then since then, over the last three years, all I’ve been doing is looking at the science of this. And of course, there’s not enough research in the United States because of these different regulations and stuff, but I’m seeing clinical evidence so that’s why I get so excited. When we’re sitting here talking I’m I’m thinking when you said much like the pharmacist right. Do you remember that old Seinfeld episode where it I can’t remember who it was. But basically the doctor prescribed something, they go to the pharmacy, the pharmacist goes, ooh, I wouldn’t do that.
What would you do?
Yeah. And it became this thing of who had more power. The doctor, the pharmacist, I say, let’s do a little YouTube skit where I’m the endocannabinoid biologist. You’re the bud tender, you’re going to be the patient and I’m going to recommend a certain strain and you could go Wait a minute. That’s not what I would do, then it would be a play off of that. But that really is kind of where that’s where the science is going with this. That’s what’s so exciting when if a patient comes in so I went and visited your store this weekend to the right next to Wichita Falls where I was, and Steve, who wasn’t there, was telling me he goes, you know, what’s amazing is the people that walk in here, it’s not 20 year old saying I want to get some weed, you know, old people with canes and they’re struggling and they’re like, I’m thrilled and goes, here’s what here’s what we’re going to do for you. This is awesome. Yeah, it goes. So when I realized that I’m making this what Steve He goes when I realized that I’m now making a difference in people’s health and goes I feel what you probably went into medicine for, which is to change people’s lives.
Exactly. And and we’re surrounded by some huge military bases in Wichita Falls and in Lawton. And a lot of our customers they they do not buy the cannabis that contains THC. They prefer the cannabis that contains CBD, the high percentage of CBD and little to zero percent of THC. You know, with CBD, it is. It is new to me also. As far as the benefits, it is huge, very huge. You mentioned the endocannabinoid system. And you know, I’ve kind of My mind broke the broke medical patients down into into three different categories ABC, a being where I want to feed my endocannabinoid system. I’m healthy, I feel good. I work out I walk. So kind of preventative. It’s kind of a preventative and then be moving into a patient that that has an element of whether it’s a backache or or a inflammatory process. The lavatory, exactly, and then all the way up to our you know, severe cancer and things where you’re, you’re really going to have to wage a major war with, with CBD. But yeah, the our patients that come into our facility, even though you could come in if you’ve got your medical card, I can sell you three ounces of Gorilla Glue. Which is a cannabis strain. I haven’t done that. I have not I have an 82 year old man that pulls up and he will buy CBD flower which is it CBD but cannabis contains CBD and THC this strain of cannabis contains 16% CBD, and like point 3% THC. And that’s what this guy buys and and loves it. He he could buy, you know, THC but the CBD is what’s making a difference. It does make a huge difference. Steve, our manager and bud tender. You know I asked him I said tell me what you think? Because he’s a cannabis user and he he picked up this bottle and he said I’ll take you away What it does for me, he said in the evening, I’ll take a dropper and put under my tongue and I hold it my mouth for four or five minutes and then I’ll swallow it. swallows it, he digest it, he goes to bed. He said that when he wakes up in the morning, that his whole body just feels rejuvenated. He pops up right up at a bed, he’s he’s ready to go take on the day. That’s what CBD does in your your muscular system it is. If you’re already in that number one zone where you’re just maintaining it. It helps keep a you say homeostasis, homeostasis homeostasis. It just keeps a nice even level balance or level in your in your body and that way you feel great when you wake up and, and then other systems will start to fall into place.
blockout want to get into it also as we move through the show cuz we’re going to have you for another hour, but there there are differences in CBD and where you get it and what’s labeled as CBD.
Exactly. And before I forget, I just want to ask one thing you said that you are surrounded by military bases. Yes. Are these are these servicemen coming in? Oh, getting
Good grief. Yes, most definitely. And, and, you know, when you historically You know, a lot of our servicemen, you know, they come in with PTSD and and you think of PTSD as you know, from guys that that come back from a war torn country and, and they’ve seen some crazy stuff and and they’re trying to deal with that and that is that is very true. But how huge our military is there. There are things that have happened in the military. It could be just having a car wreck. You know, that is traumatizing to you while your own active duty. Sure. And and so these guys you know they’re they’re looking for ways to deal with, you know PTSD and emotional issues.
So one of the things that we talked about that out my goal would be this you guys beating the people that are selling CBD and selling other marijuana products you can’t make any disease claims. What I want to do is get research so that you can have published articles Well one of the things Dr. Or Colonel Philip Blair is also a doctor is the medical director at elix. And also our CBD is powered by elix and all these the medical director there, he actually published a case series with CBD and its effect on PTSD. This is a full bird Colonel that realized The benefits of CBD and is now working for a CBD company and still seeing patients and collecting data. And so we’re going to bring him down. And he’s, he’s gonna come on in the next month. Yeah, what I really want to do is so he’s so knowledgeable about that and he’s also knowledgeable about the other thing that unfortunately happens in war, which is traumatic brain injury. And he’s actually published something on TV eyes and we were talking about possibly setting up a CMA meaning a, so doctors need certain amount of credits at my hospital, talking to our trauma surgeons, because I really believe that a protocol of doing high dose d h A plus CBD at the first impact of any type of traumatic brain injury, recent article just got published, which showed that unfortunately, they did autopsies on boys that were 16 to 19. And that had played football it had shown in these they they were unfortunately killed from other circumstances, but they they are now looking at the bird We’re looking for CTE and they were already showing signs of CTE from just high school football. Right? So we know that this TBI thing is huge. And I just love it that we have like a full bird Colonel who is a doctor. Yeah, willing to embrace it. You’re talking about it surrounded by military bases. It’s a perfect marriage. And it’s a like minded thing because essentially what you’re talking about Shawn, whenever you’re wanting to help people that have come to you for that help, you want to give them guidance that you have. It’s not just anecdotal. I think this will work. This is it’s, it’s this works for this ailment. We want to help you just like you said, you’re not selling the Gorilla Glue to somebody just because it’s profitable to you. You want to get into something that’s going to make them feel better. That’s the whole purpose. Right?
Exactly. And you know, back on the endocannabinoid system, the way this the CBD works, it just kind of calms some of these receptors. I guess it if if there’s something that it for instance, own PTSD, my wife was attacked by a dog about two years ago. We were done in San Marcos, visiting our daughter and a big bull Mastiff. Jolla got her yet
But Karen carries a lot of bacon in her purse. So it’s not her fault. I always have bacon on me. No, no, I’m nervous. Yeah, if you’re a bacon carrier don’t walk around St. Mark.
Yeah, well now you know, she has a not a phobia of just dogs. But there are times that I look at her whenever somebody if we’re in Denton, walking around where it’s a dog friendly town and here comes this guy with his Tiger strat. Pitbull. That’s a sweet dog. She kind of moves next to me and she is having some anxiety and CBD is a product that really does help with that. If We know that we’re going to go to debt and she’ll consume some CBD. And that will, you know, help help.
Well, I’ve known your wife as long as I’ve known you and Karen has never been a skittish or anxious person and I remember that incident quite vividly and you and you’re right I’ve I heard her comment that it’s unfortunate for her that that now is something that’s a blemish on an experience. But I’ve also heard her comment that CBD has actually helped her not have those anxious periods whenever we meet y’all for dinner out dinner or Yeah, and
and you know, the endocannabinoid system goes all the way down to not think 600 million years ago, you know, it was in little squids and, you know, sea creatures and still is in most of the animals today and dogs. You know, there are a lot of people that will buy this product CBD Do not give your animals THC, please don’t. But CBD does help with skin conditions with animals with anxiety with animals. It’s one of the number one top sellers in Colorado right now are the pet products dog biscuits. Yeah,
yeah. I mean, I see this all the time with my patients, they will definitely spend the money to treat their pets and not uncommonly will not have the money for their own medicines, right? But they will make sure the pets are taken care of. When we’re talking about PTSD. I’m looking at all the articles that we’re going to be publishing here soon. We’ve got autism and CBD. We’ve got CBD and IBD. We’ve got the full review of the endocannabinoid system. We’re going to do PTSD and CBD. Yeah. And, and these, these blogs are all about the science with references so that you can just hand them to people go, oh, here’s this. You can look at it. We’re not making a claim, but you can do your own homework. Just like you did, where you felt that moral obligation to get out there and be a caregiver. Now, you are actually going to have to educate in a way without making claims. And the only in my opinion is as a doctor, the best way to do it, and as an educator is to give references exactly this
is not my opinion. This is just based on these, this whole process to bring up Dr. Blair’s name again, that’s actually one of his biggest goals is how do I end up taking my research and make it more applicable to the VA and to the basis because these are the gentlemen who are fighting for our country who are putting a lot on the line and oftentimes when they go to that system, that machine, the options are limited. There’s there’s not a there’s obviously not enough counseling, they talked about them in the news today, but oftentimes, it’s just to the prescriptive therapies and not to CBD, they actually could be making a difference for them.
Yeah, absolutely. I was just talking to we were. I have a friend named retag it on back in Omaha. He’s a retired 30 years in the military and him and a group of guys have started a alcohol company called soldier Valley liquor. And we were talking about that and how they give back to the servicemen. And I’m like, man, we got to have you down on the show. We got to talk about this. I think the veterans are one of our biggest populations that we can really help and I, I didn’t even realize that you’re surrounded by military bases where they are they are seeking you out.
Exactly. Right. Yeah. And, and, and we’re there for them, we want to help them. The The side effects are just zero that I’ve seen with using CBD and compared to what they have received from the VA hospitals that cause horrible, horrible side effects and these guys, they, they realize that they’re seeing that and their spouses are seeing that and so they’re looking for, you know, some some treatment that will help them.
I mean, everything. We’re talking About comes down to inflammation, PTSD, inflammation is hyper firing of nerves, inflammatory bowel disease, the fasting mimicking diet that helped these mice that is an autoimmune issue. What I really would like to do this next part of the show is let’s geek out. I mean, you’ve got a background we can get into the endocannabinoid system. Let’s clear up some of the confusion. Let’s talk about the other things full spectrum terpenes blah, blah, blah, it’s gonna sound sciency but let’s let’s bring it back to level so that when somebody walks in your store, if they listen to this, or you can recommend them to listen to it, they’re going to know what they’re getting. Yeah, just a reset because we are reaching the top of the hour here in just a moment. But this is Shawn Bryans he is the Vice President of Operations for alternative medicine newly opened here in Oklahoma. And is there any other gentlemen websites?
Yeah, we do have on our Instagram is okie, okay.
Under underscore, Herb and we also have alternative Medicine Okay, and Instagram. Alternative Medicine okay on Instagram. We’ll see you here in just a moment if the next hour
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Hello and now we’re going to start our number two of episode number two we are still joined here by Mr. Shawn Bryans of alternative medicine he’s a VP operations of that and Okie Herb. And just a quick reminder as we start up the second hour if you are interested in picking up your own Atrantil, just go to love my tummy.com forward slash spoonie use discount Code spooning for some savings for yourself and then of course if you want to check outKBMD health CBD, you can also go toKBMD or KBMD d health.com. Or maybe somewhere else you go
That’s right. You could come over to Oklahoma and pick up some KB CBD oil. When we saw this product in our store when when Eric and I met immediately fell in love and and the first thing that that jumped out at me was, you know, having Dr. Brown’s name on the bottle. So many of our patients that come into our dispensary. That’s the first thing that they ask
is like what a doctor,
what a doctor recommend this what do what would in a lot of times, it’s kind of funny, they say what would my doctor say about me using this and that’s when I’m like, well go talk to your doctor. Tell your Doctor what you want to do ask your doctor. But this particular product that’s backed up with with research and and extensive studies, we wanted to be a part of this. We wanted this on our shelves. The The other thing that that really jumped out at me is how this product was made, how it was manufactured, how they did the extraction process. Y’all use a process called supercritical co2 extraction, so cannabinoids that are on the cannabis plant, they are oil soluble and they are alcohol soluble. And so historically, they would use some nasty chemicals like butane and propane and they would Blast that gas which in a liquid form through through the cannabis extract the the, all of the cannabinoids and then try to remove some of the petroleum products from that crude oil. And in California, they do a ton of testing on that. And California is not happy with the trace petroleum products that are still in
the it’s considered a contaminant,
it is a contaminant and some of
the the extraction method, they actually feel that that is the contaminant
Sure, can be Yes, alcohol. So, another way to extract from a cannabis plant you can take and back in the day they use things like acetone and acid propyl alcohols and some alcohols that that weren’t food grade lock everclear for instance 190 proof everclear that can be used to extract cannabinoids from a cannabis plant and and do a full CBD extraction. Now they tried to evaporate that alcohol that that’s also and they can’t. You can’t get all it all out Yeah, I have taken not this product but I’ve taken other CBD tinctures that staying real bad under my tongue. Some people like that stain, kind of like taking a shot of vodka or you know, some type of alcohol drink. For me, I do not consume alcohol. I find it Not a not always I used to like alcohol but I don’t like it anymore. And when I’m treating a patient, I don’t want to recommend a CBD tincher that has alcohol in it or other nasties in it. I want to recommend a clean extracted product that that use supercritical co2.
Let me ask you a question. Have you seen certain products that said possibly co2 extraction and then you put it under your tongue and it burns? Basically, mislabeling Yeah, itself is a little bit wild west right
now, most definitely. And you know, I’ve had patients come to us and say, yeah, we bought this that at the Jiffy Mart down the road and it doesn’t work. It doesn’t do anything and I look at it and you know, a lot of these products were were made in India or in China and I’m like hey guys i it may be the real thing but these guys and and we have other CBD lines in our store also that are that we know the growers sure and just like your guys we know where this plant came from we know that it was tested we know that it was tested for pesticides we know that that you know it was tested for levels of THC or CBD or other cannabinoids that are in it.
So when I talked to Steve last week, whenever we were entertaining the idea of moving KBMD CBD to alternative medicine, Oklahoma. The very first question he said is we can’t shelve this without a authenticated CLA or didn’t get him analysis. And can you may want to talk about this. Why did you partner with alexson all knowing that there were certain parameters that you had to meet.
So knowing that the industry itself so let’s back up and just look at the supplement industry. So my, my initial background was in clinical research doing pharmacologic studies, and then I, you know, found a few holes there. But we figured out we could do something natural to fix people. And that’s how we develop that round to once I get into until I realized, holy cow, the this industry’s, you people are mislabeling they’re making claims they’re doing things. So knowing that if I was going to get into the CBD aspect of medicine, I just wanted to make sure that I went with a company that was completely on the up and up very open, and made sure that they had complete sourcing it was an organic farm, they could naturally extract which is the supercritical co2 extraction, and really, they just sourced one company so they have complete control of everything. And that was a lexical, and I’ve been very happy that that I’ve partnered with them and when you talk to the CEO and we have lunch with Gabe, the people that are doing the right things, They want to help each other out. So they’re they’re all about if you want to do CW Charlotte’s Web do that. CBD lions? Nine, yeah, CBD lines. Another one where everybody’s like, yeah, let’s just all we’re not in competition, the good. The people that are doing the right stuff are not in competition with each other. They’re there to educate. And that’s why I want to partner with excellent because they were very open about that sure said, yeah, we just want to do this and that’s why they want to partner with me because they know that I want to be publishing lots of clinical data on this.
Yeah. So another big thing that Stephen also let me know is that we have to have CBD that is full spectrum. Now we hit on this a little bit last week. And we can get into a little bit about what full spectrum means and what the entourage effect is. We’re going to learn some words like terpenes, Phyto, cannabinoids full, full spectrum. And then talk a little bit about somebody who may appear reputable, doing things like isolettes, but what the limitations are on that, so Shawn start with you. What does it mean for something to be a full spectrum product within your? Your dispensary?
Yeah, and people that have researched using cannabinoids to treat their ailments that that’s the first thing that they asked for. They want a full spectrum CBD and it it is very beneficial because all of these cannabinoids CB in and CBD and CBG and in even THC they all work with each other. And and that’s why having a full spectrum product here extract is very very beneficial. I just I feel like that it’s the way that these cannabinoids work with each other to to address your problem.
Sure we hit on that Last week, we talked about drugs that have been formed down to isolettes. It actually underperformed compared to what it was that they were they were designed to build a whole molecule. Yeah. So I mean, GW Pharmaceuticals is kind of who are hitting at GW Pharmaceuticals that just got FDA approval for do lacks correct hippie deals out there like that, something like that, that it got approved for seizures. And it is a CBD isolate. What is interesting with that, we’re going to be publishing more. There’s a great example because I’m not a neurologist. But as a gastroenterologist, they did try to look at that particular isolette in ulcerative colitis, and they ended up having a big dropout rate due to side effects. I don’t see side effects when I use the full spectrum. No, right?
Not at all. And well, in talking about full spectrum you hit on a little bit also but they different cannabinoids as well as another word terpenes. So terpene profile can actually mean something and this is this is great for you because we had talked about where’s the science going? So CBD is new to everyone. Ces is not being taught in medical school. And that’s a brand new frontier for a lot of people to talk about. But how do you know what CBD combination is going to work for you? There actually be some some differentiation in doing that. So once you go and take that,
well, I’ll throw this to you, Shawn. So one of the things that I’ve been I’ve been doing a ton of reading. And when you start looking at some of these people who are PhDs, and they’re writing about this, it gets pretty high level and it’s like any other specialty. I’m a gastroenterologist, I spent three extra years learning the gut, just the gut. There’s going to be Endocannabinoid ologists, you’re going to go see your Endocannabinoid ologists because the science is getting so dialed in. And one of the things that’s really interesting is that different combinations may do different things for different people. So when we talk about the disease state, then somebody comes in and says, Shawn, I’ve got a My back is I’ve got sanika Can you help me with that? And that kind of thing. So I think that terpenes
are terpenes are in a replant and it’s what you smell you know tomato plant has terpenes
visit an oil
it I don’t know if it’s an oil but it is a component you know in their structure it but it does have a smell to it most terpenes do the thing that just blows my mind. These guys that manufacturer lock the vape cartridges and this is the easiest way to try to understand terpenes and how they can affect the way or change the way cannabinoids a form you they, you can do a full extraction of THC and CBD. And you can take a terpene like lambing for instance, and add to that extraction. You can consume that and have a completely different effect than if you added a blueberry terpene to that extraction
or the other one bursting. Yeah, so beta mersin is one of them that they’ve looked at where they have shown that if you have a higher concentration of beta mersin that crosses the blood brain barrier and it brings CBD with it so if you’ve got a brain issue, maybe we need to start using higher mersin levels Piper and I think is the other one that’s more for joint inflammation like we’re learning about this. It’s a brand new science and Serrano’s so exciting and it’s going to take people with a pharmacy background people I mean that’s why I love what you’re doing. I mean you have this educator background is a science and you’re bringing all that into this new space that needs to be cleared up. And that’s why we have you on the show to talk about this.
Yeah. And sees your patients for instance. They may take a they may get a perfect dolled in profile of medicine that they’re taking, and it works. So let’s say I’m having 10 seizures a day, and this is working great. After about a month or two, they may start having one or two seizures a day. And then three months later, they may have three or four and they’re like, dang, this stuff doesn’t work or I’m had built up a tolerance to it. That’s where I call it resetting the cannabinoid clock, making little subtle changes with terpenes to the same profile that that works for you the same ratio of CBD and CBD in and CBG that that works for you in treating your seizures. But I need to reset the way that is working with my endo cannabinoid. system if that makes sense. So by making a small change with a turret pain, they have found that it resets that clock and that seizure patient now is medicated and able to go through the day without having one seizure and then after a period of time they reset that clock and and and start over. So it that’s why it in our medical profession, I cannot wait till all of our doctors will sit down with the patients instead of just signing the piece of paper and sending them to the dispensary because the other thing you know, we’re lucky to have Stephen in our dispensary. I mean we really are truly blessed. I had a patient come The other day that had gone to a another dispensary that had two ladies that were retired kindergarten teachers that were working at the dispensary. And, you know, they had no idea what was in this bottle. You know, they they just knew that it was this price and, you know,
budget for the same reason it matters where you get your CBD it probably matters on who’s helping guide you to what’s going to work for
- So what I run into whenever I see anybody, there’s quite a few multi level marketing companies which are trying to get into the CBD industry. And what I have seen is that if I go to like a trade show or something, they’ll have a booth and I’ll just walk up and be like, what’s this and listen to what they say and everyone that I’ve encountered doesn’t really understand it and they’re just throwing the words out and trying to do this good. You need this. This is the this is the isolette this is this. It’s got a full terpene spectrums, like well Wait a minute, you said isolette. Now you’re saying terpenes bactrim. Do you know what a terpene is? No. And but my kids laugh because they’ve seen it happen about five times, where I’ll be like, oh, tell me more. No, you’re wrong. That is, I mean, it’s just an education thing. But if you’re just trying to move some stuff that everybody’s using these words, like, if you heard the term broad spectrum, so broad spectrum is a marketing term, there’s no such thing is broad spectrum now and you know, I find that fascinating that that’s catching on. It’s kinda like the Joe Dirt style of selling.
Its difference between blue sky and posit drag just does.
Well, the number one thing that we look for is, you know, I want to know how the medicine was made. I want to know where the cannabis came from, and I want to know that it was tested. And that’s why I can’t always recommend going and buying this own eBay or this own that you see online. For $5 and 99 cents and, and think that it’s really going to it may hurt you in
a really good point because now I want to hear your horticultural background How are you guys growing up there in Oklahoma?
Well it’s funny because you know going into this you know I’m researching you know what are going to be the next big hot strains you know, what are they doing in California and Colorado and Washington is you know, wedding cake and La confidential all these cool strains that are that are out there and but the thing is, and in our state, the demand is not for those crazy recreational crazy strange it. They want a one to one or a two to one two parts CBD to one parts or they want a our number one seller right now that we sell more of Been, I mean, I’ve got 12 strains of cannabis in jars on the wall. We sell more of our it’s highway 77 is the strain. It’s red dirt Rx, I believe grows it, but it’s it’s HAMP. It’s it’s PAMP flower. It’s cannabis that you can purchase mean we sell to Texans, what percentage
of your sales would be CBD versus THC? Oh gosh.
So let’s clarify for anybody that I mean because it’s a wide open industry. What makes hemp CBD legal? Or what makes it so that the farm bill passed and now the federal government at least recognized
Yeah, they’re looking at they don’t care about any of the 50 6070 different parts of the cannabis plant. They look at one thing and that one thing is THC, and there they want to know that that is going to be below a certain percentage. And we shoot we we see on our lab reports like point 3% and below of THC. And then anything above that with all the other cannabinoids, CBD or CBG or CBN, that they can be at at any level, you know, in the in the product, so
by law 2.3 or less Correct,
correct? Yeah. And and a lot of that may totally vary by state. There. There are some states I think, out of, sorry, this ship Patrick breaking in I’m sorry, but I think the only state that differs is Virginia, in which case it’s up to 1%. But I think other than that across the board nationwide, I think it’s 0.3%. Okay, I could be wrong, but that’s what I read. Yeah. And I think there’s,
you’re saying it with total confidence. So we trust you.
I’ve done a little bit of research.
Just a little bit. I don’t partake I just do the research
with your Watching the our computers aren’t connected. These are just props, so we can’t look anything up.
Yeah. And you know what, Chef Patrick, I want to thank you for being the producer of our show here. So what he does is he produces our show then comes on and does his own show. So make sure that you check out his shows also.
Thank you very much. Appreciate that. Hey, something I know we only have four minutes left in this segment. But something to consider right now. There are only 10 states that are legal, medically, I’m sorry, no recreationally. And then beyond that there’s 23 that have some sort some form of medical. Texas actually doesn’t fit into that because they have specific medical. Yeah. And then there are a handful of others that have decriminalized possession of marijuana or marijuana products or hemp products. So tell me a little bit what is the trouble? And I know that y’all experience a lot of traffic moving over from Texas to go to Oklahoma. What makes it so prohibitive right now in Texas, that it’s not really a medical application? Yeah,
so Texas hat does have a medical program. Only Texas their medical program there is one qualifying condition and that qualifying condition is intractable epilepsy. Not the other hundred and 30 plus forms of seizure disorders or epilepsy but specifically intractable epilepsy. A bottle I talked to a guy that we were doing a symposium and didn’t the other day that by the way ahead. I thought I was going to have a bunch of North Texas kids there. It was all a it was an entire retirement community ropes and ranch was our audience, but met a guy there that has intractable epilepsy. He paid $900 at the one dispensary in Texas for you know his his product $1 a milligram
oh my goodness,
man, we sell it you know, 50 bucks, 60 bucks. You know, depending on the product, maybe Noni Yeah, it’s crazy. So our legislature in Texas they’re in session right now. There’s no plans to to legalize cannabis in Texas on a full medical lock Oklahoma did or a recreation like Colorado. So we’ll wait another two years in Texas for our legislature to meet again. So if I wanted to sell to somebody with intractable epilepsy, I’m sure it’s really easy to do is open up a store, right? Exactly. You you write a check for 1.2 million point two and you stand in line you wait because there I believe there were about six guys that
look like this. So just you have to pay to play your disease right
now that it’s therefore but surely there’s a lot of companies out there in Texas that are providing the service right
there. There. There probably isn’t. And don’t call me surely.
So, but there are there I’m sure there’s just tons of companies that have paid the 1.2 to play right
exactly. Yeah. And only one of them got the deal. Got the contract
so that’s not a monopoly at all. No.
And and that’s what was really neat about Oklahoma. They made it very, very affordable for for guys to get into the cannabis game. And you know, our license fees are very, very cheap. 20 $500 is what
1.2 million Well, you know, what they’re doing no harm has decided they want to give access, they believe in the idea and access it cost is a barrier to access it is. That’s why we’ve priced the CBD the way that we have. That’s why we’ve priced on to the way that we have I think it’s so fascinating that the people that are swimming towards you are the ones wanting CBD which is really interesting. So everybody’s scared of THC but the people that are looking for it for medicinal use. They don’t even want the high THC strains. Yeah.
We’ve only got 20 seconds till the bottom of the hour begins. But I tell you what, stay tuned because what we want to talk about is some of the crazy happenings for people who actually suffer. We’re going to get to the recent news of David Irving. We’re going to talk about a Missouri incident in a hospital was crazy. Shawn, hang out with us another half hour All right.
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we’re back and you get yet some to throw in there, Pat?
Yeah, no, I just need to remember to unmute the mic.
Oh, yeah. No, that’s fine. We had a lot that we just said that. Nobody heard. It was great. I’m just kidding. Don’t miss anything. Hey, so hey, just to reset we are joined still this, this last half hour with Shawn Bryans VP of VP operations alternative medicine up at Oklahoma. We’re gonna hop right into because we don’t have a whole lot of time left we got it did the last hour just flew by. So something that stuck out to Dr. Brown and as we talked last week, David Irving plays football professional football player originally from California, played at Iowa State, I believe, amazing defensive player for the Cowboys. He just received his third suspension is decided that he is going to retire and he basically tested positive for THC. And he claims that he was medicating himself. And just a few things that he said, just to take into context if you have kids listening I’m sorry, I’m just going to quote exactly as he said it on Instagram. So basically guys, I quit. I’m out of here. I’m not doing this shit. No more Some people are like, Oh, you’re addicted to weed. I’d rather be an addict to that than the Xanax bars or the Hydros or the Seroquel that they’ve been feeding you. Essentially what I take from David Irving’s messages. He’s finding really this is a guy’s playing professional football. He’s getting banged around quite a bit. You happen to know somebody who played professional football for quite some time. We talked about him on the first show, I have a buddy Junior Bryant played 10 years and yeah, we we talked about it, he took it. He, you know, he took a beating with that. I mean, you get out of these are massive men and hitting their heads and I just said in the last hour, that they’re showing traumatic brain injury and high schoolers, so well, and we’ve got a friend who’s it was a pain doc MD, Kaylee boutwell. And she is looking also for alternative ways to help her patients not feel pain, and she’s been able to take people who’ve been addicted to opioids as well. There’s a lots of documented cases out there and moved him over to an alternative therapy sometimes
CBD. So this is what’s fascinating about the science of it. So what he figured out is that his endocannabinoid system needed to get back to homeostasis or get back to normal because we’re going to be publishing a lot on this but when you are low on your endogenous endocannabinoids specifically an and amide and to ag more importantly a Nanda mind because that’s the one that is kind of low level going around. When that’s low, you can see that the perception of pain is higher and when you get that back to normal your body down regulates those receptors so what ends up happening with chronic stress and with a lifestyle where if you’re not sleeping well or you’re getting banged up like that and you create chronic inflammation, a Nanda mine levels will go down your CB one receptors actually go down and the ones that are left become hypersensitive, and then it ends up creating more pain and then two weeks g goes up trying to combat that. So we’re now we’re talking about some serious science and chemistry. And he’s exactly right. Here’s some Xanax. That’s addicting. Here’s some Seroquel. We don’t really understand what that’s going to the side effects are pretty fun though because I see that all the time SSRI inhibitor, inhibitors can create lots of weight gain and things like that. And he found a way to medically correct his own endocannabinoid system and he gets suspended.
It doesn’t it doesn’t quite add up. I mean, the NFL in a really weird way I think trying to appear like this clean League, whereas compared to the NBA and the NHL and MLB which really aren’t nearly as stringent for THC. Yeah.
Jackie, you know, right before this, Randall Gregory he he got a suspension also with the cowboys and I believe it was his third suspension.
The interesting thing is
listen to talk shows and other people talking about these these athletes that that know that combine is coming up, they know that in March, they’re going to be tested. And you’re like, why does this guy Why Why does he not stop using cannabis and go ahead and pass this drug test and then use cannabis later when they’re not testing? Well, this guy Gregory, for instance, and obviously, you know, our other David or multiple cowboys and, and athletes, they need this medicine so bad that if they did not take their their medicine, they wouldn’t be playing football at all. They wouldn’t be doing any type of sports at all. They, a lot of them are taking it whether it’s for a mental condition, not just the, you know, the solar back or the source Muscles from from playing but, you know, head injuries that that, you know cause these thoughts and ideas to go on in their bodies that they need. If they don’t use cannabis, they are just going to implode and and not be able to do anything
- What I’m hearing is that when I do with my patients so let’s get back to inflammatory bowel disease. My patients need this medication, I can show on a social level, why certain drugs are needed. Let’s just use biologic Remicade, for instance. Sure. And if suddenly, Remicade was illegal, or much worse, or not worse, but I guess different when the insurance company decides not to pay for it. Yeah. Now all of a sudden my patient stuck with a $10,000 bill a month. Well, that’s a that’s a total travesty. So now we have a very similar situation where I have a mechanism of action. I can show why it’s doing well. We have a mechanism of action of Why he was taking it on a cellular level. There’s no difference between that and the drugs that we prescribed, right? It’s, I have acid reflux. If I can’t take my medicine, I’m miserable. And I will if it becomes illegal and they test for it, and I’m, you know, I’m still planning on going back. I’ve got one year left on my college eligibility. I’m going to try and get back out there. And if they suddenly proton pump inhibitors, which is what I’m on because I bad reflux, I’m miserable. I would still keep taking it.
Well, you know, it’s interesting also came because it was a few months ago that you an hour, you’d show me some research that you had run across, and there were people who had been able to move away from, I think we had one case was 28 years of opioid dependency. And and she now is not having to take opioids anymore because she was able to start using CBD, and I believe was post reg or post a car accident or something like that. But regardless, the Long term side effects of opioids is over time we talked about opioid dependency last week. Over time, you basically always end up having to take more, there’s a threshold for you to get that and the GI distress that occurs from long term opioid use is usually some crazy chronic constipation. And then you have the malaise or the flat effect. I mean, unfortunately for those who become dependent upon opioids, whether it’s oxy cotton, fentanyl patches, etc. It’s it’s not a pretty scene. So I will do a small spoiler alert right here, we actually have a we’re going to be coming out with a blog and some information on this particular thing. And so a few key points, two takeaways, it’ll be for this blog that we do.
You know, pain. This is unbelievable. It has been estimated to cost 630 $5 billion annually. Goodness, so many things are surrounded around pain because that’s the thing that drives people to go take something pain. The opioid crisis is alarming. CBD is the second most abundant phytochemical that we know that has been shown to mitigate pain perception. So our whole article is going to be about the opioid crisis, and how to help people with that. It was it’s our fault that so many patients are sick. We talked last week chef Patrick talked about finding heroin in the mosques in wherever that was right? Because there were so much opioids in the system. When I went to medical school, we were told that if you have real pain, you will not become addicted, which we now know is completely wrong, natural. And that was a pharmaceutical based message that we’re being told. And now we have the opportunity to change that a little bit here and we’re going to once again, I’m going to drive up and drop all these articles right off it.
Yeah. be interested in saying that really would it’s it’s a mate It is hard to Explain It’s hard to explain this because a lot of people may say oh well that’s Michael you’re saying it treats you know your head injury you’re saying this treats inflammation in your your back and tennis elbow and but when you do understand how it works and how the endocannabinoid system works in our body, it Yeah, it does. It really is it it really does address multiple different problems that can occur in in our body.
So since you have been opened, you had mentioned before we even started the radio show that you have had people who’ve come up who are looking for pain relief, etc. You brought our attention to a story that I didn’t know until this morning that occurred in Missouri. So we’ll we will post a link to this video in the show notes after production but there is an issue that occurred if I get the facts right there was a Missouri patient stage for pancreatic cancer. Correct. Who was in the hospital? And then due to a tip suddenly found him in his hospital room being searched. Go ahead.
Yes. Yeah, please shout, you guys need to see this video. It’s my daughter. She actually texted this to my wife and on she was my daughter was traumatized by this video, it was the craziest thing. And so Missouri did just pass a medical bill to and they’ve got a good one that they passed. Now a lot of states will pass a bill and then they have a period of time, six months to a year that they’re going to, you know, figure out how they’re going to do how they’re going to implement that bill. And that’s what Missouri’s doing. This patient had stage four pancreatic cancer. He is in a in a bad way. And he found that using and I believe he was using what they call Phoenix tears, which is a Rick Simpson oil taken in a capsule for Rick Simpson oil. Yeah, yeah and and so a lot of times if if a patient has stage four cancer or a really, really bad advances the advanced disease There you go. That’s where you have to get aggressive with your treatment and you you actually need to really shock and flood your system with as many cannabinoids I like
I said that flood your system, fill those receptors up you do not have that much time to do it. When I talk to my patients. It’s like a dry sponge and you know, we do the double Sitting here, but it may take longer. Yeah, 15 milligrams twice a day under your tongue. But if you’ve got a really dry bones, meaning your endocannabinoids are severely depleted, it may take time to hydrate that sponge. Yeah, when you’ve got advanced pancreatic cancer, you don’t have a whole lot of time you better get at it.
Yeah, you got to get after it. And that’s where Rick Simpson oil Rick Simpson invented this. He actually made his first with a coffee maker, he was using that top of pan to evaporate the alcohol. So basically, if you took two ounces of cannabis, and you did a an extraction with with alcohol and you cook the alcohol off and you, you made an oil, all of the cannabinoids will shrink down and feel like a little thimble. So it’s really concentrated. It’s tiny. That’s two ounces, right? And so these patients Like this, this gentleman and Missouri, a lot of times they’ll use what they call attacking method. They’ll do a sublingual absorption. So they’ll take a little toothpick and put a pellet of that oil on their gums and they hold it in their mouth for you try to hold it 20 minutes and it’s real Hampi it’s doesn’t taste great. They also take the capsules, Phoenix tears, bow bombs, where they have the Rick Simpson oil in the capsules
too aggressive aggressively get after this cancer. So
that’s what this guy was doing.
That’s what this guy was doing and and also the way CBD plays in that because I’ve worked with people that were in this situation. I create I call it a rescue pack. I got a bunch of different CBD products. I got You’re, you’re actually mob. One of my patients. She took this was was the first sale that we had. And it was as a rescue because she was about to consume a large amount of cannabis. And we had to get that level high fat because we didn’t have time. And CBD as we said earlier does work with THC as far as balancing that out so I didn’t want it to feel euphoria or
stones. CBD discusses the stoning effect. Yes
sir. It really does and that’s why a lot of patients want the one to one you know ratio of THC and CBD. But anyway, this guy was taking the Rick Simpson oil in the capsule form and the police got a tip from a security guard that they smell marijuana even though nobody smelled marijuana when they walked in and they go through the guy’s bag and I think they found CBD is all a family guy said look, it’s on my fingers if you want to arrest me down the parking lot you know and they go through his his hospital in his hospital unbelievable unbelief and the doctor even comes in is like do you have a warrant for this and
BC the video they are literally just rifling through his belongings while he is in his hospital bed. And it’s being filmed in the
physician a gown. I mean he’s he’s in in the bed
off of a tip that I thought I smelled some of that on
believe in a legal legal medical state. And He even told set up submitted my paperwork I’m waiting on the state, you know, I don’t have time to wait. So
it’s a it’s a wild situation. I feel just absolutely silly comparing my heartburn medicine when we have people with stage four pancreatic cancer that is making a difference in What little life they probably have. Right and they’re being harassed like that. Yeah,
nuts. You know, it’s interesting a thought just occurred to me but you said when I compare my my reflux situation to somebody, pancreatic cancer, and then I start to think, Well, you know, sometimes people, they want to know, how can CBD treat this and then also treat this but nobody asked that question about opioids. If somebody happens to hurt in a certain area, or have a different kind of pain that are completely unrelated nobody bats an eye whenever you say I’m treating with opioids for
multiple different Well, here’s something that I just learned recently. So Shawn, you know, Tylenol and insides are used to treat pain. You’ve heard of Tylenol. Right? Right. Do you know that we really don’t understand how it works until just recently?
No, no, a Tylenol is, in my opinion can be one of the it’s one of the biggest killers in our pop is one
of the deadliest drugs and we just recently found out that it actually works on the endocannabinoid receptors all along and it kills livers Yeah, yeah the inadvertent taking Tylenol so that’s a great example if we have drugs that are over the counter which are killing people yeah. And it’s now recently discovered that it’s working on the same receptors that we have a safe product that works better on it.
Yeah yet it’s you know, let’s let’s rotate Tylenol and Motrin, Tylenol, Motrin, we give it to our babies, our little kids and let me tell you, I don’t know if this is exactly true. But I compare a 500 milligram Tylenol to a fifth of whiskey or vodka as far as what my liver is going to have to do to metabolize that Tylenol pill. And so when I’m taking an opioid, the majority of the opioids and I guess it’s time to activate the opioids so your body can absorb it faster. What Ever I don’t know. All I know is Tylenol is used with just about every opioid he’s
exactly right. You got the combination drugs already Tylenol, Cody, Percocet. I mean, it’s all our
combo. And it’s there’s only one reason to do that is to try and gain the efficacy so that more drugs are sold.
Yeah, that’s all there is to it and they both mask each other not really sure which one’s working.
I don’t think Tylenol nor ibuprofen, whatever make it past the FDA. Now if it went through typical rigorous studies, I mean, the GI bleeding and the kidney failure that happens from ibuprofen and sayd, like drugs, and then of course, the liver failure that takes place. What people don’t realize is they’ll get a cold, they’ll take Tylenol, and it’ll take the equal and then they’ll take NyQuil. They don’t realize all has Tylenol. And all of a sudden I got a patient coming in and they’re yellow and their liver failure and we’re calling the transplant center and they inadvertently
over the counter products, killed her liver. Yeah, and now, I mean, I’ve just went what it is. Actually, probably we don’t even know how it works right? And now we’re realized it probably works the endocannabinoid system, which to me is just ammunition to say, look, these drugs have been around for a long time, they’re hurting people. And now we have a safer alternative that works better on the same system. Sure. Well, it’s kind of interesting too, because all a lot of this is just in my small microcosms of a much bigger thing. And that is, somebody feels like they are threatened by people finding new alternative natural means to feel better. And this is not about getting high. This is not about being an advocate for psychoactive drug recreational use or anything like that. In this particular setting, this is simply about people trying to find a better way to feel comfortable and not have to deal with pain. And even in Texas right now there’s 254 counties. Right now there’s a different way for different DBAs in each one of our counties to operate Folks the CBD issue in Dallas County. Not a big deal at all. One county over where there’s Fort Worth Tarrant County it’s for some weird reason right now. It’s a big deal. The DEA doesn’t like CBD probably not educated on it probably has no idea what it actually is just hears that it could be related to marijuana and I don’t want that. I can’t
we have patients that come from Abilene and Wichita Falls that tell us we cannot find any CBD in Abilene, Texas. It’s been pulled from the shelves, they they don’t have access to. So they may be a county very similar to what you’re talking about where it’s education. A lot of these guys still aren’t educated. That’s one cool thing that Oklahoma did do. One of the first big meetings they did have was with law enforcement to to go Over there medical plan to go over what you should do on a traffic stop that you know how you should handle this that this is no longer the devil’s lettuce we’re no longer going to be back here
I’m gonna steal that by the way the devil’s lettuce I’m gonna use it in my show today but
I don’t want to interrupt but you know as I’m I think there’s a lot of confusion out there between THC THC a CBD cannabidiol CBD CBN there’s all these terms being thrown about can we can we define for the listener? I think this is super valuable and I’ve seen this in another a lot of other states where they’re trying to educate the the end user and especially medical patients. But what is the difference between say, cannabinoids, CBD and specific specific connected dial and then THC versus what the body produces? thca can we can we discuss I mean, I think it’s very important because people still are saying they’re all the same thing they’re all they’re all THC they’re all gonna make you high but really it’s it’s not that way
now start with the THC a and THC if you want me to and you can do the CBD but the you know in the raw cannabis form and in the bud if if this plant has a percentage of THC it is actually in the form of THC a and so there’s an acid on the end of that chain. And so in the past and typically the way I’m going to release that acid chain and just have THC is I’m going to combust that material heat and smoke it and so now I’m consuming THC. So when making medicines in our in our processing area whenever I’m probably Assessing cannabis, whether I’m infusing it into an oil or an edible, I look at THC a and also look at THC. And I don’t want to just decarboxylase this material, this raw material and just make THC. I want to do that also, but I want to have a true spectrum of the plant a true broad spectrum that you talked about while ago. So I will take raw cannabis that has not been decarboxylase or heated to a point where it changes to THC and still in the THC a if when it’s in that form. You You do not feel the effect that you would if it was In the THC form so this is the psychotropic effect basically right now psychoactive but it’s like a troph psychotropic that good, good, good word there. So I would feel comfortable if I had a pediatric patient, a kid with it was having seizures and I was working with that kids parents and that child and I was going to compound or formulate a medicine for that kid. I would want to first start with a cannabis product that contain THC a and not decarboxylase the, the cannabis and release that acid chain, I want to first start with, you know, what is in this that is not going to cause this kid to have a psychotropic effect. Sometimes that may or may not work with the kid. Or the pediatric patient or adult patient
that’s what that’s where you begin you have to get again
exactly so that’s where then you start looking at combinations of let’s let’s let’s change this to THC Sure. And because we’ve we’ve found scientifically that there are some great there’s some great benefits of using THC and and let’s incorporate that with with the THC a and this CBD
This is this thank you so much for bringing that up job Patrick because this is new to me, right but you know I spend my whole world that educated myself on the endocannabinoid system and CBD and didn’t even occur to me that THC and THC can be used additionally in different ways. Yeah, fascinating.
it’s very, very interesting. And, and it works not just by ingesting so if I may, if I If If I’m using a cannabis product that I’ve infused into an oil, and part of it is decarboxylase just THC and the other part is THC a, whether I’m rubbing that on my body as a sab or ingesting it, they do have different effects. And so you can benefit by doing it both ways. And in some cases, it may be better to do it one way and and not do it at all the other way. And that’s where you know when dealing with pediatric cancer patients that I want to treat their problem but I do not want to give them any type of psychotropic or euphoria like they would get from hydrocodone or an opioid, or true THC. That’s where I’ll look at at the HCA
That’s fascinating. I don’t want to cut anything short but we just burn through two hours because it’s been fascinating. Let
me tell you what this was we covered so much ground and you were so knowledgeable and I feel like this is one of the most informative podcasts that I have heard and I listened to a lot of them and this isn’t because we’re on it it’s probably the most informative because I didn’t say a whole lot and you know Shawn you you were highly it really informed and and educated share this who’s ever listened to this just share this I want this shared with the Crohn’s and colitis society I want to share with chronic pain people. I want this shared so that people can understand that stuff like this. It starts making a difference. pdsd people I mean, we all know saturated Yeah, CTE Hey, Shawn, before we go, we have a half a minute go ahead and tell us where we can people can find you online.
Yeah, we actually you can go to okie urbe.com. We have a website we’re still working and building that website but okie underscore herb and Instagram and also Native medicine. Okay at Instagram’s
lot Shawn thanks,